call to creationists

Bowser · Posted: Sat Jun 10, 2006 4:09 pm Post subject:

I never claimed to be atheist^^

subbergod · Naginata Ashigaru Joined: Mar 02, 2006 Posts: 553

Itachi-kun · Posted: Thu Jun 15, 2006 2:34 pm Post subject:

First let me say I believe in microevolution. The evidence for it is irefuteable, but as such, Darwin's Origin of the Species puts forth macroevolution as the origin of us all. Now I'm only going to be the philosopher's advocate and show what could have happened and what most "scientific evidence" really shows. Now back to topic, the main evidence that evolution(please note that when I refer to evolution, I'm talking about macro not micro, because discussion of micro is pointless at this point) is fossils. Lucy, species that have gone extinct, ect. can all be interpreted differently. We see modern day Lucys all over in the southern states, we just call them deformed though. We don't automatically label them as living fossils or missing links. The extinct species can be explained in other ways. For instance, a fish with legs can be explained as just a species that went extinct and not that evolved and died out. Another thing that's a bit out there, evolution assumes that the more complicated the being, the more fit it is to survive. Reality, however, dictates that the least complicated species are much more fit than the more complex. I.E. Cockroaches and humans. Cockroaches are much more resilant to forces than fagile humans are. For god's sakes, the bloody incects'll survive the radiation from a nuclear bomb! I digress. Another thing to think about with fossils is the truth of the dating. They don't always use carbon dating to prove the age of the fossils. Sometimes, they assume the fossils age from its position in the rock layers when enviornmental changes could have very well moved these fossils. Now, Darwin clearly stated in the Origin of Species that if missing link fossils weren't found in great amounts after he died, that his theory was pure crap and to discard it. Instead, scientists of today come up with their own explainations to this and dilude the theory. Puntuated evolution for instance, tries to explain the lack of missing links by saying they aren't even there. Instead, we evolved in leaps. A good explaination if Darwin didn't already account for it and show that evolution in leaps is too random to occur without the help of some higher being. Now, I'm in no way advocating creation, I'm just trying to show that interpretation is everything in this field. I'm just a philosopher, it's my job to think over what we know, what is real, and what we ought to do.
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Kliedo · Heimin (Commoner) Joined: Jun 05, 2005 Posts: 76

To me, I believe in god. Simply, if you can put your faith in a person, any person, any creature, any thing, how is believing in god any different? But that's just my opinion.

Itachi-kun · Posted: Thu Jul 06, 2006 4:56 pm Post subject:

what's the point in putting faith in something that doesn't exist. If god does exist(I'm not saying he doesn't) then he would have made it clear to all humans. So, where's the grand proof?
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MiME · Posted: Tue Aug 01, 2006 10:40 am Post subject:

ultimasome · Posted: Sun Aug 06, 2006 12:31 am Post subject:

trueline · Pure Hope Joined: Jun 13, 2006 Posts: 5134

why the God doesnt exist?! i know that there are no creatures without creation so why some people said the God is fake if they do really believe that then whats the proof since they are asking for the proof of the existe.
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Itachi-kun · Posted: Tue Aug 08, 2006 9:43 am Post subject:

You're not counting on the True False Vacuum theory. Kinda like the big bang, only an infintasimly small point to explosion from reaching critical mass. So, it is possible that the universe repeats this cycle and goes on for all eternity. So, if the universe goes on forever like that, then humans could have just evolved. I never said that evolution was impossible, just that the theory of today needs to be revamped.
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NeL · Posted: Tue Aug 08, 2006 10:26 am Post subject:

god is fake?! hell no! Mad

who would create the things around us?!

chance?

chance cannot create these things, chance only comes in a while you know....

evolution?

we were made to evolve,(to learn), to change what we should become, but who created the starting point of all of these? chance?

chances are just opportunities, chance cannot make something! chances are bridges from something in the beginning...... who would create the beginning?

Itachi-kun · Posted: Tue Aug 08, 2006 5:37 pm Post subject:

But according to that argument, something would have to create god. If you want something to create the end all be all, then you have some problems with your beliefs.
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CloudBlade · Posted: Wed Aug 30, 2006 2:37 pm Post subject:

but Itachi-kun, the premise of a "God" is that it in some incomprehensible way transcends normal logic; thereby bypassing the known laws of time and space. we have to start at a given; and a God seems to be a logical starting point.

think of it this way. when you're learning basic arithmetic in 1st or 2nd grade, the teacher told you 2+2=4. you take this premise, trust it, and you continue on your academic journey; through multiplication,algebra, trigonometry, calculus, etc. you don't question the validity; and if you do, there's no way (in your limited knowledge then)to prove/disprove it.

it isn't until you get to college and post-college education, a good 10+ years later, that you can actually "PROVE" that 2+2=4 through differentials and discrete mathematics.

we, as intelligent people, are now trying to prove/disprove God with only limited knowledge. maybe there's a final answer somewhere in the future; but for now i'll play it safe and say there is a Creator.

If there is, there's some sort of life after this one. if there isn't im just dirt. either or, im gonna be dead come 2100; and this will all be over..
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Cherry-Kun · Posted: Thu Aug 31, 2006 12:52 am Post subject:

ok......looks like this thread is about if God exists or not, since im too lazy to read all the posts im just gonna expose my point of view.

first of all, im christhian catholic, that means i believe in god uni trinum(god father, god son and god holy spirit) i believe in the virgin marie and i participate in the eucaristhia.

"God exists??? yes!!! what happens to evolution???"

do you really think life was created by luck??? a little cell smacked by a lightning and then the first living being was born, is it just like that??? what if that little cell were burned by that lightning??? what helped it to live??? what help it to evolve??? why are we humans and monkeys are monkeys??? why we can think??? why can we doubt??? why can we love???...why can we love??? and the other species just can feel attachment??? why??? just by some sort of luck??? that is ridiculous if you ask me

God does exist, proofs???

your doubts, your feelings your enviroment.

there is this jocke "he was so little, sooo little than not even the minor of doubts could fit in him"..............(is a kids jocke, laugh if you want). try to put this jocke the other way around "he is so big, sooo big that not even the biggest of doubts could fit in him" and wich is the biggest of doubts??? does God exist??? see??? simple like that.

why not to believe in him??? cause he can be bother some???

we christhians believe that God is Love, that would be a resume. does Love bothers??? i think love is the most beatifull thing that could ever exist

"God=Love ^ Love=Good => God=Good"

if God is good, why is there wars??? why is ther hunger??? why the poor people??? cause we arent God's puppets. God loves us so much that he even gave us free will, we can choose between good or bad and still!!! he will love us

but why doesnt he acts??? he must do something in order to finish our wars, our hunger, our missery.....he IS NOT gonna come down from heaven and solve our problems, we must solve our problems by ourselfs, but he will always help us -keep an eye on that HELP, not Solve- through another person, so listen to your friends next time:wink:

if he is helping us, why evil is still going on??? cause no one listens to him, just a few, for instance: when george bush sent troops to take over irak saying that there were massive destruction weapons, werent there people protesting against that, coz they knew it was unfair, just to take control over the petroleum of the country and to get richier than they are??? did he do something about it???....... well yeah!! he said "oh no im sorry i was mistaken, there werent any massive destruction weapons" after destroying hundreds of homes, killing millions of innocent people. you know chris rock said something very funny about that, but i cant remeber well.........@_@ ara!!!! ara!!!! i might have gone too far, i dont want to talk about politics

to conclude this coz i have to sleep n_nU God exists??? yes!!!.....wanna ask him???

PS: sorry if there are any miscongujated verbs n_nU, let me know my mistakes
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ultimasome · Posted: Mon Sep 04, 2006 1:35 pm Post subject:

"This great universe and everything that is in it cannot be the product of chance,and could not have created itself. Signs testifying that God is the only creator can be seen throughout the earth and in the very soul of each person.
God calls people to continuously look at the universe,as this will affirm the divine truth of this existence.
Since every child is born with a natural belief in the existence of God and an inborn inclination towards worshipping him alone.
The existence of man and the entire universe is not a mere accident or the product of chance. This universe and everything that is in it manifests and points to the realization of a Creator.
Humans are weak in nature without god…they can neither help others nor can they help themselves.
God is the eternal Absolute. He neither gives birth,nor is he born,and there is nothing like him. He is perfect in this knowledge,in his power,in his will,in his mercy and in all his other attributes. God is all-powerful and perfect,while human beings are weak and imperfect."

2 post remain.
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Itachi-kun · Posted: Mon Sep 04, 2006 8:16 pm Post subject:

Well, if god is love, love is blind. Ray Charles is blind, so Ray Charles must be god. Come now, god can't be love. He can have love, but he can't be love. I'm not saying god doesn't exist here, I'm just saying that if he does exist(some of you know my stand point and I'm just trying to get questions asked here) then we just need to clear up all of the crap that seperates theists and find out what exactly is true. There's so many different denominations out there, that the truth might have just been misconstrued over the ages by man that explains everything perfectly, but what if he left it to us to figure out with our limited knowledge. So, the next and probably final point I'll make, why can't life just be chance? What exactly makes you think that chance can't become something great? Why can't our existance just be a roll of the dice? Anyways, with that, I'll wait for more comments.
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