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| What is the innate nature of man:good or evil? |
| Good |
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11% |
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| Evil |
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28% |
[ 12 ] |
| Neither |
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16% |
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| Both |
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42% |
[ 18 ] |
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| Total Votes : 42 |
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quosimos uncommoner

Joined: Aug 05, 2005 Posts: 3228 Location: Jack lives here
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Posted: Wed Sep 21, 2005 5:45 pm Post subject: |
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| CGY wrote: |
| quosimos wrote: |
| Ezekiel wrote: |
before i can answer to that you need to define good and evil  |
i take the utilitarian definition of morality: something is good if it produces more happiness than sadness |
That may be true, but that is, if the things are good. So what exactly can we define them as good? |
i think youre misunderstanding. by utilitarianism good=happiness nothing more nothing less. |
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CGY Jigoku Sensei

Joined: Apr 30, 2005 Posts: 13130 Location: The depth of hell...
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Posted: Wed Sep 21, 2005 5:47 pm Post subject: |
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| quosimos wrote: |
| CGY wrote: |
| quosimos wrote: |
| Ezekiel wrote: |
before i can answer to that you need to define good and evil  |
i take the utilitarian definition of morality: something is good if it produces more happiness than sadness |
That may be true, but that is, if the things are good. So what exactly can we define them as good? |
i think youre misunderstanding. by utilitarianism good=happiness nothing more nothing less. |
Oh... I see, so good-happiness, what about bad then? Sadness? |
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TrueAncestor The Dark Winged Angel

Joined: Sep 08, 2005 Posts: 3819 Location: Within your darkest nightmares, and your deepest desires
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Posted: Wed Sep 21, 2005 5:48 pm Post subject: |
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| CGY wrote: |
| quosimos wrote: |
| Ezekiel wrote: |
before i can answer to that you need to define good and evil  |
i take the utilitarian definition of morality: something is good if it produces more happiness than sadness |
That may be true, but that is, if the things are good. So what exactly can we define them as good? |
CGY brings up an excellent point. What is good? How do we define good? There are some things that everyone knows supposedly are good, but who decided that those things would be dubbed as good? Is good relative? Maybe everything that we think is good in the world is actually the core of evil. Anybody else think so/differently? _________________ Miku Miku!!
[img:80:120:eb3b969399]http://img112.imageshack.us/img112/6048/dancingmikudr2.gif[/img:eb3b969399]
[img:450:150:eb3b969399]http://img141.imageshack.us/img141/8021/home212uo0.jpg[/img:eb3b969399] |
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CGY Jigoku Sensei

Joined: Apr 30, 2005 Posts: 13130 Location: The depth of hell...
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Posted: Wed Sep 21, 2005 5:53 pm Post subject: |
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| So, one's good maybe another's bad... well, that makes sense, and it's more close to the truth. |
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kaykay Shogun

Joined: Jul 22, 2005 Posts: 2622 Location: Cali
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Posted: Wed Sep 21, 2005 5:53 pm Post subject: |
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lol this ques. totally reminds me of psychology.
there's these two approaches> humanistic approach: which views everyone as inherritly good..and everyone has the potential to be or do good.....basically very holistic~!
the other approach is called the psychoanalytic approach: which views everyone as inherritly selfish~!
this ques. also kinda goes with the nature vs. nurture ques. in psych.
well anyways i believe that our nature is both evil and good. sure i think we cause more damage that we intend to..but that doesn't mean our intensions are for evil purposes......but one can't ignore the fact that we're not pure and full of goodness either~! _________________
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quosimos uncommoner

Joined: Aug 05, 2005 Posts: 3228 Location: Jack lives here
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Posted: Wed Sep 21, 2005 6:09 pm Post subject: |
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its a question that many thinkers and philosophers have grappled with in the past. utiliarians believe that the happiness or sadness (of EVERYBODY, so this covers the idea that a deed produces both happiness and sadness. and throughout time) that an action produces determines its morality. they also hold intellectual pleasure over physical pleasure. utilitarianism is not hedonism.
This is a philospophy which judges actions by their consequences, something which not all people agree with. some people disagree because they think that an action itself may be good or bad regardless of its consequences. of course, another difficulty is measuring happiness and sadness.
for those who think that this sounds all too much like i read the first chapter of a book about morality, you are absolutely right. unfortunately thats all i went through before i kinda got bored. oh yea, i read some Nietzschian philosophy as well but that was beyond my comprehension. |
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pyrorecca ask for custom rank!

Joined: Sep 03, 2005 Posts: 3412 Location: In your refrigerator, eating your food
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Posted: Thu Sep 22, 2005 1:24 am Post subject: |
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If i post in this thread will it get locked?
It's like i'm the cause of all the thread locking in the free for all section
I'm a marked man.......
Anyway i think that what may be the right thing to do may not be the good thing to do
And that the evil thing to do may not be the wrong thing to do
Right & wrong, Good & Bad. two completely different things _________________ [img:309:200:9b3695521e]http://img69.imageshack.us/img69/8583/dobedobedojs0.jpg[/img:9b3695521e] |
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Jsy3k Cute Girl Lover


Joined: Aug 06, 2003 Posts: 3938 Location: I'm in deep sheet of cute girls
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Posted: Thu Sep 22, 2005 1:28 am Post subject: |
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| pyrorecca wrote: |
If i post in this thread will it get locked?
It's like i'm the cause of all the thread locking in the free for all section
I'm a marked man.......
Anyway i think that what may be the right thing to do may not be the good thing to do
And that the evil thing to do may not be the wrong thing to do
Right & wrong, Good & Bad. two completely different things |
Yes, you are the main cause why most topics have gone astray. I have sent you 2 WARNING PMs and you chose to ignore both of them. If you do this again, it will entitle a ban from the forum or worse, the entire site. _________________
Innocent Tranquility
The Smile that defies all thoughts of rationality[/ |
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pyrorecca ask for custom rank!

Joined: Sep 03, 2005 Posts: 3412 Location: In your refrigerator, eating your food
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Posted: Thu Sep 22, 2005 1:39 am Post subject: |
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Thats weird.....it says i got no new messages.......
On topic: "A saint today, is a sinner tomorrow"
Basically, the true nature of mankind differs from century to century.
Most of us today would be saints 2000 years ago. How can we say what is good or bad if we have no benchmark to compare ourselves against. What society says is a good thing to do may not be the good thing to do. _________________ [img:309:200:9b3695521e]http://img69.imageshack.us/img69/8583/dobedobedojs0.jpg[/img:9b3695521e] |
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quosimos uncommoner

Joined: Aug 05, 2005 Posts: 3228 Location: Jack lives here
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Posted: Thu Sep 22, 2005 1:44 am Post subject: |
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Jsy3k, do the responsible thing and ban him from the internet. jk jk
oh yeah, the true nature of mankind...
um, well i dont believe in that people are born sinners crap. |
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Jsy3k Cute Girl Lover


Joined: Aug 06, 2003 Posts: 3938 Location: I'm in deep sheet of cute girls
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Posted: Thu Sep 22, 2005 1:52 am Post subject: |
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| pyrorecca wrote: |
Thats weird.....it says i got no new messages.......
On topic: "A saint today, is a sinner tomorrow"
Basically, the true nature of mankind differs from century to century.
Most of us today would be saints 2000 years ago. How can we say what is good or bad if we have no benchmark to compare ourselves against. What society says is a good thing to do may not be the good thing to do. |
Check again. It is already inside my sentbox so you should receive it. Make sure your PM inbox are not full and clear up everything. If not, you will not receive anything.
Anyways, I think I have not answered the question.
Hmmm, I think all of us are born sinful and full of evil. I think that is, unfortunately, human nature. Evil minds and thinkings will always exist as long as humans exists. _________________
Innocent Tranquility
The Smile that defies all thoughts of rationality[/ |
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pyrorecca ask for custom rank!

Joined: Sep 03, 2005 Posts: 3412 Location: In your refrigerator, eating your food
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Posted: Thu Sep 22, 2005 1:53 am Post subject: |
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Yeah, banning me from the internet is for the good of humankind.
But is it the right thing to do?  _________________ [img:309:200:9b3695521e]http://img69.imageshack.us/img69/8583/dobedobedojs0.jpg[/img:9b3695521e] |
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quosimos uncommoner

Joined: Aug 05, 2005 Posts: 3228 Location: Jack lives here
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Posted: Thu Sep 22, 2005 2:04 am Post subject: |
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| pyrorecca wrote: |
Yeah, banning me from the internet is for the good of humankind.
But is it the right thing to do?  |
stupid question, do you really expect anybody to answer that?
| Jsy3k aka Stalin of cyberspace =P wrote: |
| Hmmm, I think all of us are born sinful and full of evil. I think that is, unfortunately, human nature. Evil minds and thinkings will always exist as long as humans exists. |
isnt there also good in the human mind, you cant deny it. people are okay, occassionally considerate and nice and occassionally ignorant arseholes. |
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Monsta_Mikal Conscript

Joined: Sep 19, 2005 Posts: 104 Location: Inside a Pizza Box
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Posted: Thu Sep 22, 2005 5:41 am Post subject: |
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Wow i think this in itself is a huge question
but God gave us the privelige of choice, the freedom to choose good and evil since we arent perfect i think we just tend to choose bad things alot |
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TrueAncestor The Dark Winged Angel

Joined: Sep 08, 2005 Posts: 3819 Location: Within your darkest nightmares, and your deepest desires
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Posted: Thu Sep 22, 2005 3:14 pm Post subject: |
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| Jsy3k wrote: |
Anyways, I think I have not answered the question.
Hmmm, I think all of us are born sinful and full of evil. I think that is, unfortunately, human nature. Evil minds and thinkings will always exist as long as humans exists. |
does that mean that you do not believe in divine influence? there are those (like my mother for one...) that our actions are always done because they are guided by god. but she gets mad when i say, "well what if there is no god, and all of your actions are guided by our animal desire for pleasure and destruction?" it is a possiblility that we are all alone here, but it is equally possible that we are not. but now its turning to a "does god exist" thing. i can see your point though. there was probably nothing wrong with anything until we stepped in. _________________ Miku Miku!!
[img:80:120:eb3b969399]http://img112.imageshack.us/img112/6048/dancingmikudr2.gif[/img:eb3b969399]
[img:450:150:eb3b969399]http://img141.imageshack.us/img141/8021/home212uo0.jpg[/img:eb3b969399] |
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